#2 INTERVIEW OF BLACK STUDENTS ENROLLED AT WASHINGTON AND LEE l. Have you decided upon a college major? Yes, I've decided to major in Politics and Economics. I don't know ifl'll change those. I came here thinking that I would probably do Econ, but I had my first Politics course here. I was a little skeptical at first cause it is American Government and I hated it. I did because I didn't think I needed to know much about the American government. But I had a very good professor. I had Prof. Connelly and after a while I started picking up and doing stuff. I enjoyed it. 2. (Ifthe answer to question 1 is no, skip #7.) What is your grade point average (GPA) in your major field? I have no clue. I'm taking my first two Econ. courses this semester. I had credits from summer school for the first semester Econ. course, so I'm taking my first two this semester. For Politics I think it should be good. I don't have a grade below a B. I don't know what that is. 3. What type of degree are you working toward at Washington and Lee? BA BS [science or commerce] 4. What is the occupation or profession you want to enter upon finishing your education? I have been thinking about doing international law. I like traveling, learning about other cultures, and helping people in the process. 5. Do you plan on working toward an advanced degree at some time after finishing your undergraduate program? Possibly. I was told about the University of Virginia where they have a four year program for law school as well as a bachelor's degree. Master's. So I was thinking about that, but I'm not sure yet. With me, money is always an issue. 6. While growing up, did you attend or were you personally active in church? Yeah, I was. I went to the Church of God, like most kids in Jamaica. We go the Sunday School and church and we sing and have little things like that. So you do things not just on Sunday but other times as well? Yeah, we had youth meetings on Thursdays and stuff. As I grew older, I sort of drifted away from that. Not as a religion, but less time to concentrate and things like that. How would you characterize your church involvement in Lexington? Just going to church whenever I have the time, that's pretty much it. And that's not much. 7. How would you compare your level ofparticipation in extra-curricular activities in high school and at Washington and Lee? In high school it's much better than here. I did sports. I was a member of the softball team at school. Debating. Editorial. I was a "prefect." While we are in sixth forum(?) we are chosen to be prefects. We are given the responsibility of looking after the school. We get a forum for ourselves. A forum is like a class of students. We help them whatever, ifthey have any problems. We're chosen by the principal and teachers of the school. So you said it was much better than here? Describe it. Here I have less time to do anything. I'm a member of the International Club. I'm also a member of Xi Pi Xi Society. We just got recognition as a society on campus. It's sort oflike an alternative to sororities on campus. We are trying to be somewhat different. It's not if you don't get into one of the other sorority things, because I didn't go through rush. I didn't think it was for me at all. I was a little skeptical going into this. But I met the ladies, they were really nice. I loved them, so I decided to join. And so because they 're a society, they didn 't have to do the rush thing. They do have sort ofrush, but since we're not really a sorority in the sense, it's not called rush. We haven't decided what we're going to call it yet. Is it a national organization? No, it started here at Washington and Lee. About two years ago. Christine is the president. Wonderful. So what are the activities that are involved in that? It's mainly -I shouldn't say that. I was thinking it's a support group. It's friends coming together and doing things. We have picnics and semiformals. It's much less strenuous than a sorority would be. It's more supporting each other, having fun, which is always important, because this is a really stressful campus. It is? Yeah. 8. How did you learn about Washington and Lee University? A friend of mine, Dr. Dennis Mainert (?) recommended Washington and Lee. Before that I didn't know about it at all. I told him that I wanted to study law and he suggested Washington and Lee, because his daughter had applied, so he knew the reputation of the school. He thought this place would be good for me. So I've got it wrong. You came here first, and then Sonia. Yes. So this is Dr. Dennis Mainert? Andyou knew him from home? Yes, he's a really good friend of mine. You'll realize that all the Jamaicans, we are all connected by this one person. He tends to try to suggest places that would be good for us. Is he connected with your high school? Yes, he was the chairman ofthe Excellence Coalition, which is a group of top high schools in Jamaica. We come together and help prepare students for the SAT and to apply to colleges. He's no longer the chairman anymore. He's doing something else. 9. To what extent were you assisted during the admissions process by an alumnus of Washington and Lee? None whatsoever. 10. Didyou visit the campus before you matriculated as a student? Yes, I visited in April of 95. I was offered an all expense paid weekend to come visit the campus. Of course, this was like a reprieve from school, so I did. I loved it. In spring it's really beautiful. Ifyes, under what circumstances? Would that have been one ofthe Prospective Student Weekends? Yeah, it was. There were a lot of other prospectives on campus. It's just mainly to see what the campus is like--deciding whether or not I want to -­ Was is particularly the honor students? No, I don't think so. Please describe your reactions to this campus visit. I thought it was very beautiful. I met a couple of professors and loved them. But I still felt a little alienated. I would feel that way anyway in a different country, different school. I didn't know a lot of people. I still sort of skeptical about it. What sort ofactivities did you do that weekend? They had planned activities, a talk in Lenfest. They had a little carnival thing. I can't really remember everything I did. They had quite a lot of talks and stuff that I had to go to. Did you enjoy the activities? Yeah, I had fun that weekend. It was really good. IOa. Was W &L your first choice, second, etc? Well, it wasn't my first choice. I had no second choice. My first choice was the University of Chicago. After that I really didn't think about it. I wasn't quite sure what I was going to do. A lot of people suggested me taking a year off and getting settled and deciding what I wanted to do. Frankly, I didn't think I would get in. I didn't really know the criteria that was needed to get into this school. I didn't know much about it. I'm a little confused. You said your first choice was the University ofChicago and you had no second choice. So where did W &L fit in? Of the schools that I applied to, after the University of Chicago, I really didn't have any preference as to which school. IOb. About how many other colleges did you apply to? ... I think I applied to five or thereabouts. IOc. How many other colleges accepted you? Other than W&L, one, which was the University of Chicago. I I. What made you decide to attend Washington and Lee? Mainly because they offered me full financial aid. As a Jamaican that's really important, because of the exchange rate. So that was your main reason. Were there other reasons? Yeah. I really wanted to study law, as I said. Washington and Lee is a really good place to do that. Now that I am here, I realize that if I had gone to Chicago, I probably wouldn't have been as stable as I am now. It's so much bigger. It's in an area that's not really considered safe, and it's colder. I don't know ifl would be able to handle that. So you wouldn't be as stable in what sense? I think--Chicago is really sort of out of the way. I wanted to go because it seemed to be a good school. That was the first school I was introduced to. People tend to latch on to things like that. Do you mean stable emotionally, as a student? Yes, I think I fit in quite well here. I've made friends. Sometimes it's a little, but I think it's hard wherever you go. I think I'm fine right here. Were there other factors you considered in making the decision? Not really. Coming to W&L was completely my choice. My mother really had nothing to say about it. I'm pretty much on my own. She supports me in whatever I do. I think she trusts me to ultimately--she's just behind me in whatever I do. 12. Once you decided to enroll at W &L, what was the reaction offriends and relatives? Good, you got into a college--that' s good. I probably wouldn't have been able to do that in Jamaica. Highly competitive, even if I got in, I probably wouldn't have been able to sustain the finances. I want to study law, which is probably only second to medicine in Jamaica. So it's very expensive. Also I was leaving Jamaica. I mean leaving Jamaica was sort of a big thing, just traveling in general, so that's a good thing. They were happy. Were there negative images about W&L that made you think seriously about not coming? No, the only problem I had was that it's not a very big town. It's really very small. At the time I didn't know where it was in proximity to other things. So I was a little skeptical about that. But that was the only thing. Coming here, you realize that, despite the fact that it's so small, wherever you need to go, you get a ride. People are kind enough to give you a ride. If you want to go anyplace near you can take a taxi or walk. So many things are within walking distance. That's ok. 13. Once you were enrolled, did you find the University to be as you had expected? No, it's so much more difficult. I have had so much work to do--it's crazy. But what happened was a lot people have a different image of college. They know it's going to be hard work, but you just don't know how much. I told my best friend about it and until she came here, she thought, "Oh, she's just being difficult." She came to me and she's like, well.. .. .it's a lot of work. That's the main difference. I didn't know much about the fraternity system either. That doesn't really affect me. I know a lot of guys of campus. I talk to everybody. At this moment, it's not a bad thing. I don't mind. Ifthe school differed from the way it seemed when you first heard about it or visited the campus, please describe how it differed. I think you covered that. 14. Please describe what you consider to be your greatest challenge at Washington and Lee. My greatest challenge is probably finding my little place on campus. Finding new friends, adapting to a new culture. It's really difficult. It's difficult for people from further up north. I am from way down south. It's so much harder. But once you find friends, real friends, not just acquaintances, you realize that it makes everything so much easier. That's probably the difficult aspect. How have you dealt with it? It was a little hard the first couple of months. I would go home and cry for no apparent reason. I do understand it's difficult, leaving all your friends and stuff behind. I just hung in there. 15. How has your academic performance at Washington and Lee compared with your performance in high school? Oh goodness, I feel stupid here. It's not the way anybody else makes you feel, but I work so hard but I don't feel that I'm doing as well as I did in high school. I don't know--1 guess it's more difficult in any college situation, but I just feel as if I'm not doing what I can do. There are times when I'm frustrated--like forget it, I don't want to do any more work. But I think as I adapt to the system, I do better. So, I'm hopeful. Is the system ofteaching very different? It's really very different. It's more formal in Jamaica. Here it's friendly but difficult. Lots of work, as I keep saying. But if you have any problems whatsoever, you can go to the professor, no matter how stupid you think it is. You saidyou feel that you 're not doing as well as you did at home. What does the record show? Well, I'm not sure how to answer that. Is the grading system different? It is different. We don't have GPA's or anything like that. The work is so much different. We have to write tons and tons of answers at home. Here we have papers, but we have papers to write over a certain period of time. There we're gearing toward an exam. Not really a final exam but an external exam. That was a little hard to adjust to. 16. What academic resources have you used at Washington and Lee? I've used the library, more so last semester than any other time because I had a big research paper to do and I had to write an exegesis (sp?), so I had to do research for that. I have not used the science library, because I have not taken any sciences. I am running away from that. I have to do it eventually. I've used computers. I hadn't had much experience with using computers until I came here which I think is just a Jamaican thing. We just don't have many computers. There are quite a lot on campus. I don't have a personal computer or anything and really don't have any problem finding one to use. I've used the Writing Center because our style of writing is different, so I needed a little adjusting. I've used the Language Lab for the language course I've taken so far. That was a help. I had the tapes and stuff like that. That sort of helped. Professors--oh yeah, definitely. I try to talk to my professors as much as possible so that they will see where I'm coming from and won't get frustrated. I know I can do things --I'm sort of strange to a lot of people. I'm strange to myself, but hey! I go and talk to the professors ifl'm having any problem, just to talk in general. Even ifl'm not, it's good. They're always there to help. That's mainly it. Do you have suggestions for the development ofthese or other facilities? I hadn't actually thought about it, but I really don't think so. I don't think so at all. Most of the resources on campus are pretty easy to use. I think that's the main thing that's required. 17. What factors contribute or contributed to your selection ofa major course ofstudy? My grades, I think. I love reading, but I hate writing. A lot of people thought I should major in English. I love my English classes. I'll read anything, but I don't do very well in English classes because I don't write very well. Personally I don't think so. I don't like writing papers. I'll talk as much as possible, but I really don't write very well. Also I am interested in the areas I am studying in. Politics is really interesting. Sometimes it can get boring. It depends on the course that you're taking and the professor as well. I'm lucky enough to have had really good professors so far. So I have not had any problems with that. Actually, what I've done--pick a major, any major. I have time to change, so I'm not really worried about it. I had asked you earlier, and I guess maybe I got it wrong, ifyou came knowing you wanted to do Economics and Politics andyou saidyes. You knew you wanted to study Economics, is that right? Yes, I wanted to study Econ. As I said before, I had no clue as to what Politics was. My advisor just suggested doing it, and I did. It was a good thing. 18. Have you changed majors since you have been enrolled at Washington and Lee? Sort of. I have a specified major on my I-20 form, but that's just a fill in the blank situation. Is that an international student form? Yeah. It's just a fill in the blank. I think I had History and English. I came into this with an open mind. I decided maybe I'll discover something new. Describing that change--you 've done that when you've described having chosen Economics. Yeah, I think so. It's really hard to say "Yes, I've changed" or "No, I have not". Because the things you stated on your originalform weren't really choices. No, it's just a technicality. 19. Ifyou saw a person or group ofpersons lying, stealing or cheating wouldyou report it as an honor violation? Please elaborate. Yes, I would, because I'm mad. Somebody came into the house and they stole a Disc-man. It was on our living room table. They took out the headphones and adapter, and they took the Disc­ man itself. I was really annoyed, because it was not mine. So now I'm going to have to buy this. I was just really, really annoyed at someone going into the house and doing something like that. After that I decided, I'm sorry, this is just not nice. But this is not a case where you can report someone. No because I have no clue. You've decided you would take action ifyou did know? Yeah, I really would. 20. Do you find Washington and Lee professors easy or difficult to approach? I find them really easy to approach. As I said, I have had really, really good professors. So I've had no problem at all. I'll make appointments, I'll go see them, I'll talk with them if I'm having any difficulties. For instance, I had to order a book for the class that I have. I probably won't get it until next week. So I spoke to my professor and he suggested somebody else. I got my book and I'm happy. Little things like that really help. If you don't, you're probably gonna have serious problems. Please describe in what way they are easy or difficult. Just for the fact that you can approach them, you can make appointments, you can go during their office hours, after class. They're always willing to help. I have no problems. Have you been able to establish close working relationships with a member or with members ofthe W &L faculty? Yes, I think so. It's a little hard to say a working relationship. You can define that however you want to. I just talk to the professors that I've had. After you've had your classes, you're freer to go talk to them in a less class manner. So I'll see my professors and I'll spend ten minutes or so talking to them about random things, teasing for instance. I tell them that they're evil, evil people, giving us all the work that they have and they agree. I found out--1 think he was kidding, at least I hope he was--Professor told me that they actually called up each other and plan to give us all papers and tests in the same week, to make our lives hell. I'm not sure. That sounds like teasing to me. I'm not sure. I would hope so, but hey! That is really a coincidence, don't you think? Have to check the campus and you'll find out that a lot of people do have quite a lot a work in one and no work at all in the next. That's sort of frustrating sometimes, especially when you're in the middle of that week. 2 I. What has been your experience at W &L with regard to social life? As I said, the first couple of months it was very hard. I didn't go out much because I really just didn't want to see anybody. But after a while I started going out and meeting new people. Ifyou are shy, W &L is not the place to be. You need to get out and meet people. You'll realize that they're not as bad as you thought they were. You need to have an open mind, be tolerant of others and just go out there and have fun. I have no problems with the W&L social life. It's all your choice. Ifyou want to go out and party every weekend, fine. Ifyou don't, I guess, that's just it. You really need to meet people and talk with them, have a couple of friends. So you 're saying you made that effort. .. How important to you is alcohol at a social event or social engagement? Alcohol is of no importance to me. Where I am from, there isn't a drinking age. It doesn't really matter. It's not to me "Oh, I'm at college and I can drink as much as I possibly want." I can do that at home anyway, so it's really not important. I don't think about it. How important to you are drugs at a social event? Drugs are not something I've done. I think it's stupid. I've had a different education than most people, so a lot of people don't think as I do. A lot of people are surprised that I've never smoked marijuana considering where I'm from. It's the stupidest thing in the world! Why would I want to do that? It's so stupid. So I'm trying to explain-It doesn't really matter. People do it all the time. It's not something I want to go out and do. People here do it all the time? , People at home do it all the time. It's just like smoking a cigarette. It's really not important. I think that's the key. It's not something forbidden that I would want to do. So I have not done it. 22. What experiences, ifany, have you had with Greek organizations on campus? As I told you, I'm in XI Pi Xi. That's a little difficult to define, because it's a society, not a sorority. I am not particularly interested in the other sororities. It's just not for me. It's just your choice, what you want to do. The fraternities, I've been to fraternity parties, stuff like that. It's just a means of entertainment. I know guys in and out of. ... .in fraternities and guys who are independent. To me just if you're a nice person. It doesn't really matter. The same with the sororities. Ifyou're a nice person, I'll talk to you, and if you're not, well, that's life. How would you evaluate or describe any experiences you may have had? I have not had much experience with the Greek organizations other than going out on the weekend. Having fun in general. I haven't had anything negative. I don't think so. I can't think of anything negative that has happened to turn me away from them. The intention ofthe question was open-ended. It wasn't to ask you to say something negative, just whatever it was that your experience was. 23. Evaluate your experiences with regards to athletic teams/athletic facilities/and physical education classes. I have not--I am not on any athletic team. I have been thinking about starting softball again, but that's all I've been doing--thinking. I don't really know much about the teams. I have done two PE classes so far that were really good classes. I really enjoyed them in the sense that the coaches were really helpful. I had racquetball--that was really good. I enjoyed that class. I had swimming. I hated swimming. The coach was really a nice guy; he helped me out. So the class was not as unbearable as I thought it would be. 24. How would you characterize your opportunities for "dating" while enrolled at Washington and Lee? Dating is not really something I do. Not as a --it's just not something in our culture to call up somebody and go on a date. Not for me anyway. I have never really had time to do it at home. Here, I just go out with friends--if it's a guy, it's a guy; if it's a girl, it's a girl. We just go out. I haven't really thought about it. Maybe I should. I really just have not had the time. I've been in classes, whatever activities I've had, squeezing some sleep whenever I can, but dating is just such a--it's a totally different culture for me. Here everything seems to be so much more restrained. If you do certain things, it's construed in a certain way which at home, I wouldn't even begin to think things like that could happen. I'll flirt. I flirt a lot, because it's just me. You realize that a lot ofpeople from my culture do that, and you just don't think of it in any way. But here, ifyou do it, something's going on. So I stopped. I decided I don't want to get in trouble and I don't want to get anybody in trouble--unless I really know this person and they won't take it any way. But other than that, no, the dating scene has not been working for me at all. Maybe I'll do something. It sounds like you 're saying two different things. It's irrelevant because you 're not that interested in dating, because ofyour background. But you 're also saying it hasn 't been working for you. How do I put this? It hasn't been working in the sense that, yeah, I have not been going out and looking for a date. On this campus you need a date for everything. So that's sort of inconvenient. The means of going out and getting a date, I don't know how to do that, so that's the part that's not working. I really feel as if I can't bother with it, so forget it. 25. Have you ever considered transferring from Washington and Lee to another college/ university? No, I really haven't thought about it. W&L is the kind of place that when you do find your little place on campus, you don't really want to leave. I didn't think I'd miss the campus. Then I went home and I wanted to come back because I missed all my new friends, and I had all my old friends. So I told all my old friends to come on up. That was helpful to know I have friends here that I've met and have friends from home. I'm totally happy. I.. ..to have my family up and then I'll be fine. 26. Have you had a paidjob on campus (including work-study)? Yeah, I do work study. Last year I worked in the Printing Center. This year I'm working at Admissions. It's really different. Admissions is actually work. Yes, it was work in the Printing Center, but in a different way. In Admissions it's so much more serious. You have to be careful with what you're doing, because this is somebody's life. So I'm really careful there. It's ok. Ifso, has this influenced your level ofsatisfaction at W &L? Yes, it really helps. It gives you a feeling ofresponsibility. It helps you to view life a different way. It feels as if you have to go out and work for a living, which you really don't do it two hours a day. But it sort of helps in that way. Instead ofjust going to classes and then going back home and not doing anything. This is your responsibility--you have to go to work. 27. Would you be willing to recruit other students for Washington and Lee either as a student yourselfor as part ofan alumni program? Please elaborate. Absolutely. I've done that. I go home and I talk for Dr. Meinart. He has classes. I tell people what W&L is like. I lay down the facts. This is what it is like. It's not for everybody. What do you say? They usually ask questions. I try to answer as honestly as I possibly can. What do you mean when you say I lay down the facts because it's not for everybody? Well, in them asking questions, I try not to make the campus look as if it's something that it's not. I tell them that it's a lot of work, tell them about the fraternity which plays a big part, especially for the guys. Now that they've pushed back rush, I find that the guys are more relaxed. That probably helps. I talk to them about that. Sitting here on campus, we need to get out there. I can't say for other campuses. But here you really do need to go and talk about the professors. They're good guys. It's a different culture altogether, so this might be different for a lot of people. I tell them what it's like. It's not all fun and games; it's a lot of work. Now we ask some background information: 28. In what geographical location did you grow up: I am from Kingston, Jamaica. In what type ofarea or community did you spend most ofyour growing up years? I live in an urban community. I live in Kingston. Kingston is a big city. We only have two, and Kingston is one. 29. Describe the type ofhigh school you attended. My high school is also in the city. It would be equivalent of American private school. But in Jamaica it's actually a public school. We have to do the uniform thing, be nice, get up when the professor comes into the classroom, things like that. That's what my school is like. Was it predominantly black, white or mixed? This is difficult to answer. I think it's predominantly black, but for us, the typical Jamaican is mixed in one sense or the next. We are coming from such a really wide culture, background and all that. There's rarely anyone that's not. So you don 't mean mixed in the sense that there's some white people, black people, Latino .. ? We do have that, but we have intermarrying where you have--it's different. We all look differently because it's just like that. 30 Please give the kin relationship(s) between you and family members in your home when you were growmg up. 31. What was the highest level ofeducation achieved by your parents, guardians, or others with whom you lived when you were growing up? I don't much about my father. My father died when I was 13. My mother didn't get that good an education. I'm not sure where, but for that reason she has always pushed us to go to school. She's not one of those people who pressures you to be brilliant. Just be what you can be. Do your best. She has always supported me in what I do. She'll sacrifice whatever she can just to help me in school. Sounds wonderful. She is a good person. What are the occupations or professions ofyour parents or guardians? My mother is self employed. She sells little things. We have chickens. We sell chickens and eggs and stuff like that. So it's what we would call cottage industry. She works out ofhome. That's interesting to be able to live in an urban setting and still be able to do things like agricultural things. 32. As compared to other W &L students, how would you characterize your overall social class position (based on parents' education andfamily income)? Oh, I'm definitely in the lower class. In comparison to W&L people especially, I'm definitely in the lower class. But I mean I really don't think about it, because it's what you do. I realize, hey, I don't have money, so whatever I do have, I have to spend it wisely and do whatever I can. How do you think this has affected your experience? It hasn't really at all. Apart from the fact that I don't have a car, which is really matter since I can't drive. It doesn't matter. Ifl need something, go get it. I think that's the way it should be. 33. In general how do you think about yourselffirst at Washington and Lee -­as a member ofa particular racial/ethnic/national/gender group, or as a student? I think of myself as an international student. Just looking around the campus and all of that, I realize that I'm different. I speak differently. I react differently to things. For instance, people here just love snow--I hate it! It's wet and it's nasty. Little things like that. It makes me realize, oh yes, you're definitely an international student. 34. How homogeneous do you believe black students are on this campus? In thinking about it, there is some degree of homogeneity in that they all seem to come together as soon as they enter the campus and find a little group by themselves. They'll have meals together in the dining hall, things like that which it's really unfair for me to answer such a question. I think I have different perspective than a black American would. The reason that you are included in this interview group is that when you entered the school, you identified yourselfas black, so that 's why we 're asking you the questions as well. But it sounds like you 're not thinking ofyourselfin that way. When you 're talking about their homogeneity, you 're saying "their." Yeah, what I realize is I just talk to everybody just to get a feel for what goes on. What I realize is that a lot of people on campus, black Americans, they. think of themselves as having lost their roots and all of that, which is something I just have no clue as to what they're talking about. They say "we are from here, we are from there,"--I think that's the richness of all. You're from so many different places. You should just love it. That's what I am about and I just love it. I can relate to so many different things. We are English and Spanish and we have people from all over. You know, we have different aspects of different cultures, and we make it our own. That's what we love about it. 35. How similar or different do you believe blacks and whites are on this campus? Consider the same categories that are mentioned in number 34 above and add any other factors that you deem important. I've never really thought about this. How different are they? Probably very different. I guess it sort of depends on the individuals in this case. Some individuals will--you just don't segregate yourself. You talk to everybody, you mix with everybody in both races. But there are others that just don't, not intentionally, I think. But I guess it's just what they've always done. But you did say you think they 're pretty different? Yeah, I think that it's probably the individual. I can't really answer this question as a group. As a group, I'm really not sure. 36. Do you believe the size ofthe black student enrollment at Washington and Lee is adequate or inadequate? I'm not really sure what the ratio in the country .... .is like, so I'm really not sure at all. I'm not sure what the ratio in the school itself is like. I know there are definitely not enough international students, because that's what I talk about all the time. We need more international students..(??)...! think that's what we're here for. Do you believe the number ofblack professors is adequate or inadequate? Probably inadequate, because I've only met one so far. I don't even know what he teaches. I've only seen him on campus. Wait a minute--! think I had him. I'm not really sure. I think you should hire somebody as a result of their characteristics, not their color. That's just not important. If you're gonna teach somebody, it's their life you're dealing with. They're gonna go on and get a job based on what you've taught them or what they've learned from you. So that's what I think should be important. Do you believe the number ofblack administrators is adequate or inadequate? Explain. I'm not sure what this has to do with anything. Are you asking? Some ofthese questions come from things that have come up, feedback we've gotten from other surveys. These are questions that will mean more to some people than to others based on their own perspective. We 're asking you for your feedback. Ifit's irrelevant to you or you haven't thought about it, that's what you can say. We have just one black administrator, the administrators are the deans, that sort ofthing. You 're right--we have had only one or two black professors. Some people have mentioned that as meaningful to them. You can give your response. I really haven't thought about, but, as I say, it's really just the qualifications that people have. I think that should be more important than anything else. So you wouldn't say adequate or inadequate, it sounds like. It's just not that relevant to you. 37. Should the university offer activities designed to bring new black students together? I don't think so. They have a Minority Students Association. Bringing them together is one thing, but segregating them from others is another. I think we have to be careful about that. You have to go out in the world and deal with many different types ofpeople. College should be a reflection of life. You have to go out there and deal with people, come on. Talk to everybody. You'll realize that there people out there who are so interesting. Some that are not. Just go ahead, yes, if you want to bring them together, if that's what is needed, fine. But be careful not to segregate yourselves from others. I think there is an ingrained need to identify with people that you think are similar to yourself. Sure, I come together with my friends all the time and we talk. We share a culture, we have a dialect. We'll just break down and we'll talk. But we have to go outside of that, and we make friends. As I told you, my best friend is here. She does not spend that much time with me, because she's made new friends. She's in a different class than I am. If she's having problems, she'll come over to me and she'll talk, because that's what I'm there for. You can't just cling to one group. You need to enrich your life and go out there and meet new people. I think whatever program that they want to start, they should be careful in that way. Has the Chavis House played a role in your life at W&L? Please describe. Not really. I have friends living in the Chavis House and I'll go over and visit. But a case of identification, no. I live in the International House and that's what I identify with. Has the Minority Student Association played a role in your life at W &L? Please describe. No, I'm not a member ofthat. As I said, I don't really think I share the same problems. The problems that I share mainly with international students. 38. Do you believe that it is important that courses in the humanities/social sciences include recognition or study ofworks by persons ofcolor? Doesn't it? I'm not sure. I just take course I like. If that's what people want to take, go ahead, fine. You need to do whatever kind of work you can identify with, not just something you're gonna do just for the sake of other people think this is the right thing to do. Just go ahead, take courses that are fun. This is what you want to do, do it. This question is based on there is some suggestion from some (?) in the culture and at the university that in social sciences and humanities courses, for instance an art course, that there ought to be effort to be sure that people ofcolor are represented--artists that happen to be people ofcolor or writers. So that's what that ... Yeah, you can do that. You need to learn about different races, different cultures. Yeah, that's a good thing. Things like that are important. You need to see different perspectives, depending where people are from. In that sense, yes, I could recommend something like that. Ifyou think works by persons ofcolor should be included do you think the recognition was adequate, inadequate, or excessive? Please explain. I have not really--! don't think I've encountered any kind of work by people of color. I think that depends on the course that I'm doing. People...numbers... You haven't taken that much ofhumanities and social sciences. No, what I have done so far. I've done history courses in high school. I've done West Indian history. You just have to do that. But then we did U.S. and European history. I'm not really sure if it depends on ifyou've done it to know if it is. 39. How would you characterize the climate in the classroom for you [ as a black student]? I don't think about it. I really don't. I go into class, I'm a student, I have to worry about listening to a professor, not getting bored if it's a boring class. Yes, they can be, or ifyou're tired, try to stay awake. I just have not thought about it, and I get this reaction also from others. You'll discuss slavery, for instance. I guess other people, blacks, even whites in the class, would feel uncomfortable. It just doesn't affect me. Something that happened in the past. The reaction for U.S. citizen and a Jamaican are different because the experiences are different. We live on an island, we can't do anything. We have ruins, we go up in the mountain, they can get them, fine. That's life. So it's just different experiences. I have not thought about. I have to worry about getting good grades and surviving. That's mainly it. Ifyou have encountered 'problems 'in the classroom, how have you dealt with those difficulties? No. 40. What is the role ofthe Office ofMinority Student Affairs? I have no clue. How can the role ofthis Office be improved? I guess if I was a member of the Minority Students Association I would know if their needs were being met. But I am not. I can't really say. 41. From whom do you receive the greatest emotional support on campus? Do not use name(s), but please describe the person(s) in terms ofrace, ethnicity, nationality, gender, and position (i.e. fellow student, faculty member, administrator, staffmember). Ifappropriate, include more than one individual and describe the type ofsituations in which the person provides emotional support (i.e. personal, family, religious, etc.) Probably the greatest support of campus is my friends. It's a dual role. I have one particular friend who is closer than others on campus here. IfI have problems, I'll go and talk to her. She'll come to me when she is having problems. Ifit's something that we can't deal with, we'll suggest somebody else. As a student, you prefer to go to your peers. Other than that, if I'm having a problem that I know that a friend can't deal with, I go to my host parents. I have host parents. I go talk to them. I'm lucky enough, they're nice people, very, very nice people. They take care of me all the time. They'll call and check off if I need anything. They're people like that. They're from right here in Virginia. Race, they're white. They're Americans. My host dad is a professor. He's traveled a bit. I think it's a volunteer program. I'm sure they just don't pick you up and say here. He's had kids, you know growing kids that need support. My host mom is just the same. She works here on campus also. They're great help. Whatever I need, I'll call. That helps. Let's rewind a bit. You said your friend, you have a particular friend, so could you describe them. OK, my friend. She was born in New Jersey actually. She moved to Virginia a couple of months before she started. She had a hard time adjusting also, so we sort of supported each other. She's also white. She was on my hall. She had problems with her roommate, little things like that. She would come over and talk and I'd encourage her. She would hang out in my room--you know, the part on the back thing. I'd try to help out because I really understood. That's why I paid not to have one, I really couldn't deal with that. She did, so she had problems with that. Little things like that. Problems with classes, I'll go talk to her and she'll give me en~ouragement. Just as when she's having problems, I'll do the same. 42. Have you experienced any discriminatory behavior on campus directed against yourself? No. Even ifthere was any, I have not noticed it. I am probably a little bit more thick skinned towards things like that than some people. Leaving aside behavior, do you sense racial tensions on campus beyond what exists in the larger society? No, other than behavior, I don't think so. What I've noticed so far is just as a result of behavior. As I said, it's not really any discrimination in the sense that it's something done to other people. I'm never quite sure. You can always suspect that something is going on. It's just what you think. Behavior, in the sense that it's more on the part of the blacks segregating themselves. You need to go out there and deal with other people. If you segregate yourself from a group, they're not going to put themselves out of the way to get to know you. It's just been like that as far as I've seen in this country. Ifso, how do you think such tensions could be eased within W &L? I don't think there's anything that a program could do. It's what the students have to do. They really have to get out there and talk to other people. You will be surprised to find there are interesting people out there despite the fact of you know they look or even how they behave or how they dress. You really can't look at the surface and make a judgment. You need to leave your group once in a while and talk to somebody else. 43. Aside from the Honor System do you believe that the student Executive Committee, the Student Conduct Committee or other University judicial committees treat black and white students equally fairly? I don't know. I have not had any experiences with these committees at all. 44. Do you believe that the honor system is applied in an even-handed way to black and white students? I would hope so. Yeah, I'm sorry. I told you about my little incident that somebody came--1 don't really care if they're black or white, I want my player back! That just annoyed me. I really don't care. I would hope so. 45. How wouldyou evaluate student publications (i.e. the Ring-tum Phi, the Trident, etc.), the student radio and television stations with regards to opportunities for black students to participate. I really haven't thought about it. I think if you want to do something like that, you can. I just never thought about doing it personally. It's not my field. But I think it's open. It's mainly for people in Journalism. I have friends who want to do that. They are interested in writing or things like that. How would you evaluate them with regard to their treatment ofnews about black students? There's not much news about black students, but I don't know if there's anything to report. There's not much going on. The Greek system seems to overshadow everything else. That's understandable. I don't think there's much going on to report. 46. Do you feel that black students at Washington and Lee today have problems that are basically different from, or basically similar to those ofwhites? Please describe in what way you feel they are different or similar. It's probably different in the sense they have problems. Well, I shouldn't say this, but I think they do have problems adjusting on campus. So they get together in their little groups which mainly consist of other blacks. I mean, yeah, if you want to do that, sure. But as I keep stressing, you really need to get out of that group sometime. That's a stable group for a little while. If that's what you need to do to sustain yourself, fine, but you really need to have other friends. I don't know ifl'mjudging unfairly, but I've seen so far is there are acquaintances but not friends. The black students with each other? With white students. There is no open hostility or anything like that, because it's a friendly campus. You just need to go out there and deal with it. *47. Sex Female *48. Age? 20 *49. Year in college? Sophomore *50. Cumulative grade point average [as of Fall 1996]? 2.441 *51. How do you identify yourself in terms of nationality? Jamaican 52. How do you identify yourselfin terms ofrace? I'm not sure how to interpret this. I really don't think of myself in terms of race, I think of myself in terms of where I'm from. I'm Jamaican. That's what I am. For a Jamaican, that probably means you don't have one single race. 53. Are there additional comments you wish to make about any aspects ofWashington and Lee? It's a very good place, very good in terms of academics, get an education. To meet people, there are very interesting people out there. Some are not, but there are quite a lot of interesting people. Just go out. Meet them. Have fun. Don't think about it. Ifyou're going to be bogged down in issues, such as Greek issues, race issues, gender issues, you're just not gonna get anywhere. You need to know what you believe in and go out and have some fun. Isn't that what it's all about?!